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Author Topic: Any information on Southcoast Explorer sailboat  (Read 22531 times)
brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« on: March 24, 2011, 04:23:06 pm »

The hull number has a manufacturer's code of TSA which (according to the Coast Guard) corresponds to Explorer Yacht Inc. The location matches as Oldsmar, FL. However, in other databases, TSA is listed as both Explorer Yacht Inc. and South Coast Boat Co. My guess is that Explorer Yacht was probably a subsidiary or brand name of South Coast Boat. This would explain why my placard has both names. I'm quite certain that this company has nothing to do with South Coast Seacraft in Shreveport, LA. However, I can't seem to find any listing of South Coast Seacraft in the MIC database.

My boat was built in 1980. The company started in 1975 and went out of business in 1983. Other than the name of the company I haven't been able to find out anything about this boat. According to the Coast Guard database, Explorer Yachts built Outboards, Open Motorboats, Jon Boats, Canoes, and Kayaks. There is no mention of sailboats. My guess would be that those items were manufactured by South Coast boats and they added the brand name Explorer Yachts when they did start making sailboats. Common sense would, of course, suggest sailboats for a yacht company.

I haven't been able to find out what they built, how many, or how many models. I haven't been able to find any information about my boat. In fact, I haven't even been able to find anyone who either owns or has ever heard of boats made by this company. Basically, the only proof I have that this company ever existed is the MIC database and my sailboat. I can post information about my boat but I have no way of knowing what might have been altered since 1980. It was already 25 years old when I bought it.
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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2011, 07:38:27 am »

Since no one here recognizes the company, presumably they didn't build very many sailboats. Also, after reading some other posts here, I'm leaning in a different direction. If South Coast started out building Jon boats, kayaks, and canoes, then they probably didn't suddenly design a sailboat. More likely, they bought the molds from another company or perhaps even bought hulls and simply did the finishing work. Either way, this would mean that my sailboat is probably a common type and the manufacturer's placard means very little. So, I guess I need to post pictures to see if someone can identify it.

1.) On the transom you can see the boarding ladder on the left along with a stern light and bilge pump port. The engine mount is on the right but I'm not sure this was the original mount since there appear to be additional bolts that don't attach to anything.

2.) The keel is quite thick. From what I can tell, the bottom of the hull and the keel is filled with concrete for ballast.

3.) The keel has a slot in the bottom for the retractable center board.

4.) I'm holding the centerboard which weighs 80 lbs. It's fiberglass on the outside but I'm not sure what is inside it. The density seems to be about twice that of concrete but not nearly as heavy as lead.

5.) One feature that might be somewhat less common is that the cabin roof is supported with a wooden arch instead of a pole.
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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2011, 08:16:53 am »

1.) Inside the cabin there is a small sink on the port side. You can also see the space for the porta potti under the vee berth.

2.) On the starboard side of the cabin there is a two burner, propane cook top.

3.) You can see the cooler/step and the quarter berths under the cockpit. I think the electrical panel is original but I think the cigarette lighter and car stereo were added later. I think the boat probably came with a marine radio, depth finder, and speed log.
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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2011, 08:25:14 am »

1.) The boat apparently came with a Bimini top but I don't see how it could be used while under sail. There is a lot of brightwork that doesn't seem to serve any purpose other than decoration. You can see the shore power plug just behind the cabin bulkhead. You can see the starboard dock light. It has two lights in the cockpit and I believe originally had an electric horn. I think it also originally had some kind of lights on the spreaders.

The boat is about 20' long. The mast is 23' 4". I have no idea how much the boat weighs but the trailer (which I'm certain is original) has a weight limit of 1,650 lbs. I'm thinking maybe 1,350 lbs for the boat and an allowance of perhaps 300 lbs for outboard, fuel, sails, water and equipment.

2.) This probably the best view you could get of the keel.

3.) The yellow and white Genoa hoisted along with the old main sail.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2011, 04:33:45 pm by brehm62 » Logged
brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2011, 08:42:51 am »

1.) Here you can see the forward hatch in front of the mast. You can see the hinged seat in the back of the cockpit. You can see the winches on the sides of the cockpit and the jib tracks on the side decks. You can see that the rigging uses a backstay.

2.) Here you can see a feature that seems pretty unusual to me. There is a round metal plate in the center of the cockpit floor. It has a hole in it that runs down to the hull bottom. I'm guessing that this hole might have been used for a mast crutch. You can just make out the chain port behind the bow cleat. This port just runs into the cabin. The anchor rope would presumably be stored under the vee berth. You can also make out the cabin vent on the port side of the cabin roof just behind the side mirror on my van.

The mast head has a spinnaker bail but there is no evidence that it was ever used. The bracket on the foredeck has three holes. Obviously one would be for the jib tackline and one for the forestay, but I don't really know what the third is for.

Maybe with these pictures, someone can now identify this boat.
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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2011, 04:36:32 pm »

Still no replies? I have to say I'm quite surprised. Is my boat that unusual?
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brehm62
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« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2011, 08:42:47 am »

I have to say that I am truly stunned. The expertise on here for identifying boats is pretty amazing. So, if no one here has ever seen a sailboat like mine then what does that mean? Could this really be a low volume design by South Coast?
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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2011, 12:06:14 pm »

Well, if no one here can identify my boat does that mean it gets a new entry in the database?
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Cormorant
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« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2011, 02:20:07 am »

Hi there

Relaaaax buddy, it's just a boat name  ;)  Your boat is called a South Coast Explorer 21 (not to be confused with the SC21).

There is a South Coast owner's association that could probably help you get into contact with people that are in the know for those boats http://southcoastus.tripod.com/  There is a guy on their forum that is going to start restoring his so he probably has already gathered some info (you may want to contact him):



Good luck!
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 02:50:16 am by Cormorant » Logged

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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2011, 12:09:22 pm »

Well, you gave it a good try and I do appreciate that. However, I believe you are falling into the same trap as John Pollard on Sailnet in assuming that a similar sounding name means the same manufacturer. I'm pretty certain that the Southcoast Boat Co. in Oldsmar FL had nothing to do with the Southcoast Seacraft Co. in Shreveport LA.  I'm guessing that South Coast Owner's Association will be a complete dead end but I'll follow up with it anyway.


These two boats are only superficially similar:

SC - 21 (Shreveport, LA)
Fractional rig
Lazarette transom, strong sheer
Rudder shaft internal
Blocks for main sheet on lazarette
No folding seat
No bridge deck

Metal ballast
Fin keel
One window per side
Blunt cabin front with optional window
Built-in flotation
Vee berth
Separate shroud anchors
Winches on cabin roof
Tracks on cabin roof and side deck (cockit coaming is side deck)

Weight - 2000 lbs
LOA - 21' 4"
LWL - 14' 4"
SA - 191 sq ft


Southcoast Explorer (Oldsmar, FL)
Forestay goes to masthead
Narrow transom, vertical (no sheer)
Rudder uses pintles and gudgeons
Blocks for main sheet on cockpit sides
Folding seat in cockpit rear (with storage underneath)
Bridge deck

Concrete ballast
Thick, long keel with swinging centerboard
Two windows per side
Sloping cabin front with no place for window
No flotation
Vee berth and two quarter berths
One shroud anchor for both shrouds
Winches on cockpit coaming
Tracks only on side deck (side deck is outboard of cockpit coaming)

Weight - about 1350 lbs
LOA - 20'
LWL - 17' 9"
SA - 145 sq ft

There is a similar superficial resemblance between my Southcoast Explorer and, say, a Venture 21.

I now know that at least two other of these boats do exist. The picture you posted is E0033 built in 01/80. My boat was the very next unit, E0034 built in 04/80. I've seen another one built in 1981. That suggests to me that only 45 - 55 of these boats were built before the company went bankrupt in 1983.
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Cormorant
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« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2011, 12:46:25 pm »

I went with the name of your boat as per in your photo and the length which got me to the Explorer 21 and then the resources I found.

You know, it may be rather challenging to find the actual builder etc. For example each of my boats go by various names, because over the years (and even simultaneously) they were built at different manufacturers around France. For example my little one is just referred to as a Vaurien, but not a (insert builder here) Vaurienn, because everyone had the plans and/or moulds. I'm sure I could probably track down exactly what company built my particular boat, but that does not interest me so much.

Though yeah, these things can be of major interest nevertheless. So I can't blame you! However at least you can be sure it is called an Explorer, and likely an Explorer 21 or perhaps Explorer 20 (but I could not find anything about an Explorer 20 - whereas the Explorer 21 gave me that hit)...

Well anyway I gave it my best. Hope you find what you are looking for!




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brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2011, 01:12:57 pm »

To the best of my knowledge these two companies have different Manufacturer's Identification Codes.

SCS - South Coast Seacraft

TSA - Southcoast Boats

My Hull Identification Number starts with TSA which is still associated with Southcoast Boats (presumably because the company name is still being maintained on file). However, I assume the South Coast Seacraft boats would start with SCS which is now associated with Stowe Canoe in Vermont. I assume the code was re-assigned because South Coast Seacraft is no longer on file.

The name you found was mentioned by John Pollard at Sailnet. He assumed that Southcoast Boats and South Coast Seacraft were the same company so he added the word Explorer to distinguish it from the real South Coast 21. I assume that my boat is simply called an Explorer because this is what it says on the placard.

I'm quite certain that my boat was built in Oldsmar Florida. The trailer is also from Florida and differs from the boat date of manufacture by only one month. If the boat were built elsewhere then presumably the trailer would have been also. Again, the placard name and location matches the registered manufacturer for the MIC on my boat's Hull Identification Number.

Even a lack of identification is helpful because it suggests to me that my boat cannot be a common type with many different manufacturers. Apparently, mine actually is a limited production model with maybe only 50 units total. I assume that Southcoast Boats did indeed originate the design and molds. Otherwise, someone should be recognizing my boat as something else.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 04:06:29 pm by brehm62 » Logged
sonosail
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« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2011, 02:46:29 pm »

To the best of my knowledge these two companies have different Manufacturer's Identification Codes.

SCS - South Coast Seacraft

TSA - Southcoast Boats

My Hull Identification Number starts with TSA which is still associated with Southcoast Boats (presumably because the company name is still being maintained on file). However, I assume the South Coast Seacraft boats would start with SCS which is now associated with Stowe Canoe in Vermont. I assume the code was re-assigned because South Coast Seacraft is no longer on file.

The name you found was invented by John Pollard at Sailnet. He assumed that Southcoast Boats and South Coast Seacraft were the same company so he added the word Explorer to distinguish it from the real South Coast 21. I assume that my boat is simply called an Explorer because this is what it says on the placard.

I'm quite certain that my boat was built in Oldsmar Florida. The trailer is also from Florida and differs from the boat date of manufacture by only one month. If the boat were built elsewhere then presumably the trailer would have been also. Again, the placard name and location matches the registered manufacturer for the MIC on my boat's Hull Identification Number.

Even a lack of identification is helpful because it suggests to me that my boat cannot be a common type with many different manufacturers. Apparently, mine actually is a limited production model with maybe only 50 units total. I assume that Southcoast Boats did indeed originate the design and molds. Otherwise, someone should be recognizing my boat as something else.
I can tell you that there at least 2 other people are following this. And it's not as though you haven't provided enough photos and a lot of other information. It's just that, so far, we aren't coming up with any thing useful. (besides Cormarant, who made a great stab at it). If someone actually solves the mystery I will certinaly add it to the database.
I haven't given up though.
In the mean time, you might try boatdesign.net if you haven't already.  There are a number of real wizards over there with this kind of thing.
Completely different from the SC21. We know that.  Almost certainly a different company.
Unfortunately, Southcoast is not exactly a unique name for a company based in FL.
Obviously somewhat rare. Where did you get those dimensions?
I just wonder if it's a splashed copy of something with another name. 
If you do find the answer without our assitance, I'd really appreciate it if you'd let me know. 

Regards,
Randy Browning
sailboatdata.com   
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 03:36:28 pm by sonosail » Logged
brehm62
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Boat Type: Southcoast Explorer

« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2011, 04:05:47 pm »

I have to say first that this is a great website.

I've seen you guys identify models from one picture of a badly maintained boat setting in the weeds somewhere. I've also seen Cormarant provide excellent information on some pretty obscure boats. I'm not really surprised that he picked up the false lead from John Pollard at Sailnet. I would imagine that Sailnet has some pretty sharp people as well, so an incorrect identification there would tend to spread in the absence of other information. I've been searching online since I got my boat in 2005 so I know how scarce the information is.

1.) http://www.sailnet.com/forums/introduce-yourself/58390-just-bought-my-first-sail-boat-dont-know-how-sail-p.html

2.) http://southcoastsailortalk.multiply.com/photos/album/87/1981_Explorer_21#photo=1

These are the only two I've found and both were incorrectly identified as South Coast Seacraft boats. The first was from two years ago and he stopped posting at Sailnet after that thread. The second is from four and half years ago and it was just pictures. His MSN identifier there is out of date. I suppose John Pollard might have gotten the name from the pictures at South Coast Sailor Talk since those date back to 2006. If I could chat with them I would of course ask them what their placards say.

I don't believe that either has the original trailer; I'm pretty sure mine is original. I noticed that both of these are missing the bow pulpit and bright work. My bow pulpit brackets are corroded and cracked, and the tubing is only made of aluminum. Similarly, I just got through removing almost all of the bright work from mine because it didn't seem to provide anything beyond decoration. The original bright work is three pieces per side (wooden handles on the forward slope of the cabin roof, larger ones on the flat rear of the cabin roof, and long thin handles outside the cockpit coaming) plus the bow roller, bow top rub strips (presumably for dock lines), wooden guides for the cabin hatch, and wooden retainers for the cabin door. The hinged seat is wood but mine was not original so I can't say exactly what this looked like. There are also rub strips on the forward edges of the seats inside the cockpit. Mine also has a side plate for a trolling motor.

I notice now that neither of other two boats have dock lights. And the 2nd boat has no running lights. It also has no bilge pump exit port and no tie down points on the stern. Perhaps mine is a fancier model and the regular models didn't have the dock lights, bilge pump, running lights, or bright work. Mine also originally came with a depth finder and speed log. I suppose these too might suggest a more expensive model.

What did you think of my reasoning though? According to the Manufacturers Database, Explorer Yachts/Southcoast Boats was in business from July 03, 1975 to May 31, 1983.

The boat in the #1 link has a unit code of E0033 while mine is E0034 from three months later. At this rate of production I can't imagine they got more than about 50 units out the door.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 05:50:53 pm by brehm62 » Logged
brehm62
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« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2011, 05:43:54 pm »

Oh, I see; you are looking at the X 21 on the sail. Yes, that would suggest a length of 21' but I measured the boat again and it is almost exactly 20' from bow to stern. I can't see how you could get 21' unless you counted the projecting bow roller for the anchor line.

The main and jib sails were made by Ratsey and Lapthorn in NY so that doesn't really help in terms of location. The main is pretty well worn. However, the jib is in much better shape. It doesn't look 30 years old and it has the same sailmaker's label as the main. There are battens all the way down the leech on the main. The jib appears to have been either repaired or upgraded with a steel cable inside the jib luff. The cable is heavy enough to use as a forestay. I'm quite certain the steel cable and thimble attachments were not made by Ratsey and Lapthorn. The main uses all leather whereas the rub areas on the jib use a heavy synthetic material. I might think this was for racing except there is no wear on the spinnaker bail.

Yes, I keep wondering about its being a copy because 50 units wouldn't seem like enough to warrant a new design and creating brand new molds. But, if it is a copy then shouldn't the unit volume be high enough to make it more easily recognizable?

Yes, I'll have a look at boatdesigns.net. And, thanks for everyone's help.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 05:47:03 pm by brehm62 » Logged
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