[Wolf Larsen]

Need exact sail measurements (luff, leech, foot) for the AMF Force 5 mainsail… I tried to contact the Force 5 Class Association, but no dice, they probably went the way of the dinosaur. Boat production was discontinued decades ago, but the Force 5 sail is close to what I’m looking for in a sleeved, loose-footed mainsail. Reason I want the specs is because I bought a Topper sailboat from England, the rig is similar in size, and Topper (though still alive) wants beaucoup bucks ($500-$700) for their replacement sail, while Intensity offers a Force 5 replacement or training sail for $200. Simple math, that’s all, and we’re not talking the Cup Series here, just recreational sailing on a nearby lake. Soooooooo… if you happen to know the sail measurements for a Force 5 mainsail, please post those measurements here so I can compare them to the Topper rig specs. Thanks in advance,

Wolf Larsen

Elephant Butte Lake, New Mexico

Topic

[Wolf Larsen]

Tried to edit my initial post, no luck… meant to add that I bought the Topper off Craigslist (Albuquerque) for $100, and the boat is in good overall shape (garaged its entire life when not in use), but the mainsail is MIA, so I’m looking for a replacement. Intensity Sails seems to be my best bet, no way I’m paying 3 times as much for a Topper sail to be shipped from England. Meh, if I can’t get an answer to my question, I’ll order the Force 5 sail from Intensity anyway, it looks to be the closest match to this Topper rig. Again, this isn’t Cup Series racing, just recreational sailing on the lake (i.e. party voyages). Thanks in advance to any Force 5 sailors out there who have the sail and can measure it, aye? Cheers!

[Bruce_Sailboatdata]

We do not have the measurements but can tell you the Force 5 sail will be too big for your Topper. The Force 5 is a bigger boat with a main reported to be 91 sqft vs the Topper at 57 sqft. (there are actually three sizes for the Topper, there is also a 45 and a 69 sqft main).
Cutting the sail to make it smaller is an option but is not as simple as it may appear and not usually recommended.

[Wolf Larsen]

Some hand in the Force 5 Class Association is going to measure the sail and let me know… I think this particular Topper rig is the largest they make. Not gonna worry about the sail area until I have the measurements. I might check the Intensity Sails website one more time to see if they offer anything else that might be more suitable, but my initial scan indicated that the Force 5 sail is the closest thing to the largest original Topper sail. Another look at the website is in order, lol. This search for a sail is like a “forensic” investigation, only Topper is still alive in England… the “forensic” side is with the AMF Force 5.

I suppose I could always go with a lateen rig like that aboard my old Minifish, I’m not chained to this Topper rig, but paying extra for the spars would defeat the purpose, which is to be a cheap b@stard, lol. Cheers!

[Wolf Larsen]

I did take another look at the smaller Laser sails, the Laser 6 and 4.7, one of those might work, depending upon the measurements… I’ll have to convert the metric sizes and compare them to my spar measurements for the Topper rig.

 

[Wolf Larsen]

Funny thing, I’m a lifelong proponent of tall rigs, but the Laser 4.7 sail is very close to the spar measurements of the Topper, particularly the foot (which is very nearly spot on), but the luff is roughly 15″ too short. Topper mast length from masthead to gooseneck is 14’8″, mast length overall is 17’4-3/4″ (including that section which drops into mast step), so I COULD conceivably cut down the mast by 14″ or so, repositioning the masthead or replacing it altogether with an end cap, but it smacks of SACRILEGE to cut down a rig, lol.

However, the Topper hull is much lighter (HDPE, i.e. plastic compared to the glass hulls of my Laser and Minifish), and the wind often howls out here in the high desert, so the lousy 50-square-foot mainsail from the Laser 4.7 might actually work alright for the kind of recreational sailing my friends & I will be doing. The other option is to EXTEND the spars—easy enough to do if you’ve done it before—and go with more sail area, aye? It’s an interesting proposition, but as I said, it goes against the grain of my nature to CUT DOWN a rig, lol.

But if I DID cut it down, that Laser 4.7 sail would be perfect in all other respects, lol. AND I’d save $500 or more, since the Laser 4.7 sail is only $140 or whatever from Intensity. I’m not worried about the leech measurement, the luff and foot measurements are what matter in this rig-fitting scenario. My Laser had a 76-square-foot mainsail, my Minifish had about 65 square feet, and those sails were more than enough to power those boats in breezes of 15+ knots, especially when I sailed solo. I’d frequently take passengers with me on party voyages, no worries.

So I’m actually considering cutting a few inches off the upper mast section, lol… in the general scheme of life, most guys are concerned with ADDING inches, and here I am, about to hack some off, BWAHAHAHAHA!!! Meh, I have nothing to prove to anybody, I’ve already ” made my bones”in the nautical world… this whole Topper scene is solely about party voyages on Elephant Butte Lake, and possibly towing the kayak (also HDPE) if friends bring guests (i.e. slim gals). Small craft warning, yeah, the Topper will tow the kayak, lol. Rigging will be beefed up anyway…and surface chop? “FUHGEDDABOUTIT!”

Say, are there any Laser sailors reading this thread? I’m a diehard Laser man at heart, though I had fun aboard the Minifish, and I also intend to have fun aboard this Topper sailboat. Like I said, I’ll beef up the running rigging and substitute Harken blocks as always, the Topper blocks look like absolute junk, lol. Well, they may work for hoisting and storing hulls in a garage, but that’s about it. Webbing slings under each hull, no worries. Meh, we’re also technical rock climbers, we’ll figure it out, lol. I always built custom cradles in the past, but this Topper hull ain’t exactly high-dollar Cup Class carbon fiber, aye?

Anyway, here’s a link to island shots you won’t find anywhere else on the web… dating back to multiple voyages in the 1990s. Islas Coronados—aka Islas Los Coronados, the “Los” being an honorific for the four Coronado brothers, who were loyal to Spain back in the day—the islands are designated wildlife sanctuaries off the northern end of Baja. So much fun in those days, to sail out there and spend the night! Each voyage was really more of an expedition, with an ascent made to each island summit, and good times had in each location. You’ll find island photos on both pages of this old thread, two sets of pics per page.

http://forum.oausa.net/viewtopic.php?t=3072

 

Here’s a link to photos of solo sailing the Minifish the length of the Salton Sea… right down the centerline of that bad boy, roughly 30nm due to evaporation and a shrinking shoreline. Both Salton Expeditions were heller fun,  but Salton Expedition II was a real adventure! The Salton is an awesome sailing venue, most people are clueless about it because they never make it past the foul-smelling muck & shoals of rotting fishbones which line the lakeshore, lol. Not for the faint of heart (or stomach), the Salton, but a radical sailing venue when the wind howls! I almost didn’t launch the Minifish on Salton Expedition II, with the desert winds gusting to 30 knots.

http://homesteadingforum.org/threads/sailing-the-salton-sea.16683/

Oh, yeah, here’s a blog on the first voyage to Isla Norte, which still stands as the best solo night of my life… what an adventure that voyage was, lol. But then again, EVERY voyage to Los Coronados was an adventure back in the day, I doubt you could pull those voyages now without getting in trouble… wind up donating your boat to some Baja official so his son could learn to sail, lol. No thanks… I already made enough voyages out there, and I’m glad I went when I did. No need to spend the rest of my life in the Tijuana Jail, lol. Who sang that song, the Kingston Trio? I’ll have to find a link…

http://sandiegoreader.com/weblogs/tales-adventure/2011/may/01/isla-norte/

And the Kingston Trio! Lol… carbon-dating myself here!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=V95vhxXhHNQ

Right, time for another ice-cold alcoholic beverage… I’ll keep ya posted on developments with the Topper!

CHEERS!!!

 

[Author]

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